PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

General information to do with the PlayStation 1 Hardware. Including modchips, pinouts, rare or obscure development equipment, etc.
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PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by buttersoft » September 20th, 2014, 10:46 pm

I have a PS1 (SCPH-9002) and am keen to try some different video cables on my TVs for better picture quality.

Does anyone know where you can buy PS1 S-Video cables in 2014 for a reasonable price? I might even be able to use a fully or sufficiently populated SCART cable, if anyone can tell me where to get one, and then adapt to s-video with one of these http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/New-RGB-Scar ... 53efa76d50?

How about making my own cables? Does anyone know where to get a fully-populated or even partially-populated but adaptable Sony Multi AV plug? Splitting molded plugs is a pain, but i guess i can try with the cable below.
Shadow wrote:The PSX doesn't support YPbPr, but you can use S-Video though that if you rework the cable.
Does anyone have a link to a guide on how to do that? I'm assuming he meant using a component cable plugged into a PS1, then turning the RGB it outputs (that was either RGB or YPbPr on the PS2 through the same pins) and turning it into s-video, but how do i do that? I'm happiest tinkering, actually, but i'd prefer not to break the bank.

My TV's are HD and FHD, but both have VGA input. How can i get VGA out of the PS1 using cables/converters?

Assuming i use an el-cheapo component cable for PS2/PS3 http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/HD-Component ... 3f396d8827 can I get a signal out of the SCPH-9002 PS1 and wire it straight to a VGA plug? (EDIT: ok, no i can't do this, cos i need C-sync. See the bottom of this post)
Sony Multi-AV port (at the Playstation)
Image
Pin Name Description
1 GND Ground
2 R Right Audio
3 GND Ground
4 L Left Audio
5 Y S-Video Y (Luma)
6 CVIDEO/SYNC Composite Video/Sync
7 C S-Video C (Chroma)
8 VGND Video Ground
9 B Blue
10 +5V +5 VDC
11 R Red
12 G Green
VGA pinouts (looking into Male plug from outside)
Image
Pin Name Dir Description
1 RED --> Red Video (75 ohm, 0.7 V p-p)
2 GREEN --> Green Video (75 ohm, 0.7 V p-p)
3 BLUE --> Blue Video (75 ohm, 0.7 V p-p)
4 RES RESERVED
5 GND --- Ground
6 RGND --- Red Ground
7 GGND --- Green Ground
8 BGND --- Blue Ground
9 KEY - Key (No pin) / Optional +5V output from graphics card
10 SGND --- Sync Ground
11 ID0 <-- Monitor ID Bit 0 (optional)
12 SDA <-- I2C bidirectional data line
13 HSYNC or CSYNC --> Horizontal Sync (or Composite Sync)
14 VSYNC --> Vertical Sync which works also as data clock
15 SCL <-- I2C data clock in DDC2, Monitor ID3 in DDC1
Assuming for the moment that i have this right, in order to deliver a complete video signal at the best quality, i should connect...

PS1 output pin # - VGA pin #
6 - 13
8 - 6
8 - 7
8 - 8
9 - 3
10 - ???? (Do i need the +5V connected?)
11 - 1
12 - 2

I would expect to leave the audio leads on the component cable alone. Or will i need to deliver audio down the VGA cable as well, and how? I do have some old logitech PC speakers that will take RCA, though might need an amp. I can probably scrounge one. What source/plugs do TV's displaying VGA normally pull audio from?

Does anyone know if any or all of the above is correct? *Can* i use the common video ground of the PS1 into all three video grounds on VGA like that? Are all ground types common to both? Does VGA run at different impedance, or with different capacitance in the the lines?

Sorry for being such a noob! Great forum you guys have here, and glad to be able to contribute an idea, though it's probably completely harebrained. Answers to any or all of these questions will be greatly appreciated :)

PLEASE DO NOT TRY ANY OF THE ABOVE - until someone who knows more than me can confirm it's a good idea ;)

EDIT: Shit, i just realised i need to get C-sync out of the console too. I know i can probably open it an just wire right to the video pins, but i'm trying not to do that yet. I might buy a SCART cable and use that instead of the component cable, then, if anyone can tell me that the pinouts above can go straight to VGA the way i thought? (I don't have a TV that takes SCART, only YPbPr, S-video, VGA, HMDI and USB. Hopefully C-sync is going to work on these TVs...)
Last edited by buttersoft on September 20th, 2014, 11:32 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by buttersoft » September 20th, 2014, 10:59 pm

Or should i just buy an RGB-VGA converter/scaler because the above post is retarded and i've misinterpreted everything? Recommendations for one of those?

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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by Greg » September 20th, 2014, 11:34 pm

PS1 S-Video cable: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002NZ ... UTF8&psc=1, I bought one, a few month ago.
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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by buttersoft » September 21st, 2014, 12:43 pm

Not to be down on you, but are you certain yours is S-Video? A multimeter would show whether the centre-plug of the yellow AV lead is connected to *any* of the S-Video pins (resistance would show a zero value). If so, the signal you're getting from the cable isn't S-Video it's just using an S-Video plug, and not really any better than using straight composite cables, as i understand things. In fact it may be worse - http://pinouts.ru/VideoCables/svideo2RCA_pinout.shtml. A lot of cheaper S-Video cables for different consoles do this.

You can tell if most cables are S-Video by looking closely, though it may not be a perfect method. In the first picture below, the S-Video lead of this combined S-Video Composite lead is using thicker cable. It's double-coax, to transmit the Luma and Chroma signals and their respective grounds. The AV cords are single coax. I used this img cos it's easier to see. The official Sony S-Video cables had a thicker strand like this for the S-Video connection too. It's not impossible for the wires to all be the same size, but i'd want to test any cable like that before accepting it was S-Video.
Image

In the next image below, you can see that all the leads are the same size. This is a KMD/Komodo lead. I haven't tested the PS lead, but people online report that the KMD N64 S-Video lead is garbage, and feeds composite down the S-Video 4-DIN plug. It looks the same as the PS lead pictured. Most of the cheap cables available are like this, some admit they're only delivering a composite signal and some don't, and that one on Amazon doesn't look good.

Image

TL:DR
- anyone know where i can get a good Playstation S-Video cable at a reasonable price?
- anyone know where to get a fully-populated or even partially-populated but adaptable Sony Multi AV plug?
- anyone know how to convert/rewire an RGB SCART lead into a VGA plug?
Last edited by buttersoft on September 21st, 2014, 3:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by buttersoft » September 21st, 2014, 2:32 pm

Ok, i found a diagram for the Playstation 2/3 RGB out to D-SUB (VGA?) on pinouts.ru - but I don't think it's right for PS1!

Using the pinout diagrams in the OP, i think we should have pretty much have:
PS2 Pin Direction VGA Pin Description
GND 1 -?- not used (audio ground)
LT 2 -?- not used (PS right audio output)
GND 3 -?- not used (audio ground)
RT 4 -?- not used (PS right audio output)
Y 5 -?- not used
SYC 6 >> 13 Composite Sync/C-Sync,NTSC/PAL
C 7 -?- not used
VGND 8 --> 6 RGND one PS pin 8 (VGND) connected to 3 VGA pins (R/G/BGND)
VGND 8 --> 7 GGND one PS pin 8 (VGND) connected to 3 VGA pins (R/G/BGND)
VGND 8 --> 8 BGND one PS pin 8 (VGND) connected to 3 VGA pins (R/G/BGND)
B 9 --> 3 BLUE
+5V 10 --> not used (if picture is too dark try to connect VGA pin 9 here)
R 11 --> 1 RED
G 12 --> 2 GREEN
Hmm, it seems the PS2 outputs sync-on-green. Does anyone know if the PS1 outputs C-Sync? Is C-Sync just a part of the composite signal by default?

I guess I'll try to find a genuine PS1 RGB SCART cable and break the neccessary signals out of that?

EDIT: Gradius from PSX-scene posted up the following a few year ago:
You can get C-Sync directly from GPU (IC203) pin 156 too.
H-Sync is on pin 159 (from IC203).
V-Sync is on pin 158 (from IC203).
This might complicate things. I think the last two are the H & V in RGBHV, and that the PS1 H & V sync isn't going to be right for proper RGBHV. It might need processing. Does anyone know what those syncs are? I might have to measure them with a multimeter. I did find out that RGBHV is the same thing as VGA though, in terms of video signal :) For reference VGA is 640x480 pixels at 31.5KHz horizontal line rate and 60Hz refresh

I presume the RGB signals each need a 75ohm resistor to ground, and 200uF capacitors in line, but how about the H & V lines?

I'll post up anything else i find out :)

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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by Greg » September 22nd, 2014, 9:33 am

I confirm, it's a real S-Viseo cable. :-)
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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by Greg » September 22nd, 2014, 9:39 am

Some info about C-sync..
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1 x SCPH-7501, 2 x SCPH-7001, 2 x SCPH-5501
1 x Pro Action Replay with "Dual Rom Mod", ROM 1: Caetla, ROM 2: UNIROM
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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by buttersoft » September 22nd, 2014, 3:24 pm

Greg wrote:Some info about C-sync..
Thanks for that, i'll give it a read :)

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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by DD-Indeed » October 16th, 2014, 1:15 am

Could this type of S-Video be Sony's official product ?


Image


I have already a original Sony's RGB-cable, but since there's always been chat about those two cables, the S-Video vs. RGB, it would be finally good to solve, that which one of those two, is the best option. :P

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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by Shadow » October 16th, 2014, 1:26 am

RGB is better than S-Video and S-Video is better than composite which is better than RF.
All in all, always use RGB.
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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by DD-Indeed » October 16th, 2014, 3:44 am

Shadow wrote:RGB is better than S-Video and S-Video is better than composite which is better than RF.
All in all, always use RGB.
Is it true, that best and REAL RGB-cables for PS1 are the ones, which have PCB inside the SCART-head ?

Like this:

http://s30.postimg.org/imd0va0qp/20140403_100505.jpg

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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by Yagotzirck » October 16th, 2014, 4:59 am

I don't think so, the PCB you're talking about probably just includes 3 capacitors+1 resistor rather than having those components separately, and connects the various wires to its respective scart pin(see here for reference).
"best and REAL RGB-cables" would be the ones with each wire properly shielded, cheap ones are detectable by the thinner cable and the buzzing noise on speakers which increases as the picture gets brighter(though they're still RGB and they're acceptable if you don't keep the volume too loud)... then there are composite scart cables being sold as RGB ones, but that's another story

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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by Gradius » October 16th, 2014, 5:35 am


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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by DD-Indeed » October 16th, 2014, 5:00 pm

Yagotzirck wrote:I don't think so, the PCB you're talking about probably just includes 3 capacitors+1 resistor rather than having those components separately, and connects the various wires to its respective scart pin(see here for reference).
"best and REAL RGB-cables" would be the ones with each wire properly shielded, cheap ones are detectable by the thinner cable and the buzzing noise on speakers which increases as the picture gets brighter(though they're still RGB and they're acceptable if you don't keep the volume too loud)... then there are composite scart cables being sold as RGB ones, but that's another story
Good to know. But I bought that, when I saw, that it is official Sony-product. There's logo in the plug, that goes to console. But could that cable be for PS2 ?

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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by Yagotzirck » October 17th, 2014, 1:02 am

Don't worry about that, rgb scart works with both psx and ps2(i switch them using the same cable all the time :))

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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by DD-Indeed » October 18th, 2014, 8:06 pm

Yagotzirck wrote:Don't worry about that, rgb scart works with both psx and ps2(i switch them using the same cable all the time :))
So there is no difference between them and there's no different versions of that cable ?

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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by Yagotzirck » October 18th, 2014, 10:56 pm

the only trouble you could get that I can think of is if you've bought the japanese rgb cable, which is identical to euroscart minus the different pinout:
Image
Image

Other than that, there aren't any differences between ps3/ps2/psx scart rgb cables(read: the same cable is interchangeable between all the 3 of them) :)

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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by DD-Indeed » October 19th, 2014, 8:51 pm

But if I check those pinouts and it's JP cable and I need a EU pinout and that cable is with that PCB and therefore, pinout cannot be changed ? :D

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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by Yagotzirck » October 21st, 2014, 7:32 am

lol don't cross the bridge until you come to it :D
Anyway, once the cable has arrived and turns out it's the JAP type, you could try a JAP to EURO converter such as http://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/euro ... erter.html
But until then it's pointless to think about all the possible problems that might arise ;)

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Re: PS1 RGB/S-Video cable/output type questions

Post by DD-Indeed » October 21st, 2014, 8:58 am

Yagotzirck wrote:lol don't cross the bridge until you come to it :D
Anyway, once the cable has arrived and turns out it's the JAP type, you could try a JAP to EURO converter such as http://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/euro ... erter.html
But until then it's pointless to think about all the possible problems that might arise ;)
Well, there's might be hope, since it works fine with Sony Bravia. :P

Edit: I played and it's not afterall working fine with the TV. So I made new post about that. Next.
Last edited by DD-Indeed on October 22nd, 2014, 3:38 am, edited 1 time in total.

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